Mileage/Reliability for an iron barrelled 225

[Adam_Winstone]

Is that the PM Tuning 62mm crank (HPC) with 116mm rod? I've got a similar motor on the bench with this crank and the Mugello 70mm Meteor piston for 116mm rod, which I was thinking of using in a Rapido barrel that I'd run at 200cc. This barrel was machined down by 1.5mm to get back some grunt from the Race porting spec, however, the ports have come down so far at 225 that I'm now in the position to be able to do some additional packing/port positioning top or bottom.

Unfortunately, the casing that I was going to use this on is obviously warped from welding and trench machining for a 64mm stroke crank, which leaves me thinking that I might start with another casing and not having it welded. The PM crank seems to need very little trench work for the big end.

Food for thought... thanks.

Adam

[Dimitrios_231]

My problem Adam is when I'll find spare time to do it.
Don't expect to hear news soon,I'll probably finish it next year.
Thank you and Eden and everyone else for sharing your knowledge and experience.
I really enjoy reading all your posts,especially the long ones

[Dimitrios_231]

Is that the PM Tuning 62mm crank (HPC) with 116mm rod?

No, I went as cheap as possible
it is the 62mm MEC RB spec from AF,they have also machined the conrod but I found out that I also need to machine some tiny parts from the crankcase.

http://www.afrayspeed.co.uk/index.php?p ... tributeID=

I've never read any bad review about this crank, yet
The guys at Scooterotica garage were also using them (machined) without problems in RB25 and other engines producing around 20-25 Hp.
I don't think that my engine will produce power higher than 20 Hp,you know that I like Clubmans and Amals MK1
If I had the money,I would have gone for a second Supercorsa 62mm from JB Tuning like the one on the Rapido.

P.S. After reading Eden's amazing blog,I decided to reject the 62mm from Tino

[mainstand]

Well I've bitten the bullet & work on my 225 starts in earnest this week...hopefully it'll be sorted for Brid.

[Steve J]

You need to see what the port timings are like as the Italian Lambro 200 barrels that I've played with (2 x imports fitted with Lambro 200 barrels with spigot machined down and stud holes reworked for 150 casing use) have had inlet durations over a standard TV200 barrel. This duration will change a little when bored out to 225, however, you'll want to consider your options and what port timings you wan to end up with.

Also, whilst the Italian Lambro 200 inlet has very long timing, the port is very thin (bottom edge to top edge) and you may need to remove a lot of metal from the top edge to give the port a decent area.

In standard port configuration these Lambro 200 barrels really pull (carry as many bags of spuds as you like... at 30mph) but do not rev, and I really mean do not rev! Even with a free revving pipe, the porting of the Italian barrel just doesn't allow the motor to rev and you get so far up the rev range, totally 'hit a wall', and must change up. The ride of these, unless the porting is modified is really nasty.

I've not seen the SIL Lambro barrels but, if the SIL 200 barrels (150 and 200) are anything to go by, don't expect ports to be cast too well or for them to be symetrical through their length, which really shows up when they are bored out beyond their intended cc. Note that working transfers throughout their entire length is not very easy.

Who knows, these SIL Lambro barrels might be a decent starting point for a 225 conversion but you'll need to examine the barrel once over-bored and then have to do a fair bit of porting to give a decent end result.

Let us know how you get on

Adam

Adam - thanks for the input - as you suspected, the inlet port is extremely low. The overall height of the cylinder is 101.7mm, and the lower edge of the inlet port is around 100mm from the top! Looks like the only way to use the cylinder would be to enlarge the inlet port and fit a reed valve. Exhaust is already fairly large, and transfers are approx. 12mm in height. Time for a rethink.......

[Adam_Winstone]

Well done for checking before spending the money on additional work.

Adam

[Toddy]

Some iron barrel 230 footage ;p

tree attacks me 1:57 in to this video to say it made me jump is an understatement.

Twiglet!!!!!!

[jonashford]

Is that the PM Tuning 62mm crank (HPC) with 116mm rod?

No, I went as cheap as possible
it is the 62mm MEC RB spec from AF,they have also machined the conrod but I found out that I also need to machine some tiny parts from the crankcase.

http://www.afrayspeed.co.uk/index.php?p ... tributeID=

I've never read any bad review about this crank, yet
The guys at Scooterotica garage were also using them (machined) without problems in RB25 and other engines producing around 20-25 Hp.
I don't think that my engine will produce power higher than 20 Hp,you know that I like Clubmans and Amals MK1
If I had the money,I would have gone for a second Supercorsa 62mm from JB Tuning like the one on the Rapido.

P.S. After reading Eden's amazing blog,I decided to reject the 62mm from Tino

I use this 62mm crank in my rb engine, but the 107mm rod, Ive used it for 2 seasons it done around 17000 miles now, I renewed the big end after around 13000 just before the euro as a matter of course. The case hardening had started to wear on the big end of the rod, so that was replaced. Been a very good crank at that price not over priced like a lot of others I could mention. Highly recommend it. The crankcase needs no machining just a little filing on the mouth when the crank is at bdc

[Dimitrios_231]

This is what I did for the crank.
It spins clear now.



Squish set to 1.3mm. 1mm base packer with 2 gaskets plus a 2.5mm head gasket.
The top ring is 2mm below cylinder top.



My transfers,not finished yet.
The left in the picture needs little work plus I'm waiting for a NOS mag flange to match it.

Do you intend to cut the skirt on the piston so it clears the transfers?

Doesn't make that much difference if you do or don't tbh, Ive done the mod to all but one of my pistons, the one I didn't do it on was the one I put in on the way to Avignon, just because I took a new piston not thinking I would need to use it so I hadn't cut it at all, it went ok so I have never bothered to change it, its still in the engine! Mind you, I haven't had that engine on a dyno with it like that so who knows........ yes Adam you fanny... its not been on a dyno for over 18 months

I decided not to touch it,thanks.

I think you are talking about the kickstart side.



The flywheel side looks fine.

[Dimitrios_231]

Crankcase transfers almost done.



The wider Wiseco small end needle bearing.

[Dimitrios_231]

Back from the crypt,
I found few saved pages from the old forum,enjoy

http://web.archive.org/web/201309091005 ... &start=165

[Dimitrios_231]

The build is really slow,
my time is very limited,
I managed to do an exhaust and carb dry fitting,
I cut the head cowl,everything fits now.
I'll have to do the porting sometime in the future and plus start the assembly

[Adam_Winstone]

Cool

[LateAgain]

Excellent read. Cheers Dimitrios, Eden and Adam in the main.
I may have answered some of my own questions and thrown up new ones!

Adam, I may be hassling you soon for info and advice.
Eden has already had some hassling...
... and Dimitrios put me onto a Wiseco piston link, but I think I'm heading in the Wossner direction.

[LateAgain]

Is that the PM Tuning 62mm crank (HPC) with 116mm rod?

No, I went as cheap as possible
it is the 62mm MEC RB spec from AF,they have also machined the conrod but I found out that I also need to machine some tiny parts from the crankcase.

http://www.afrayspeed.co.uk/index.php?p ... tributeID=

I've never read any bad review about this crank, yet
The guys at Scooterotica garage were also using them (machined) without problems in RB25 and other engines producing around 20-25 Hp.
I don't think that my engine will produce power higher than 20 Hp,you know that I like Clubmans and Amals MK1
If I had the money,I would have gone for a second Supercorsa 62mm from JB Tuning like the one on the Rapido.

P.S. After reading Eden's amazing blog,I decided to reject the 62mm from Tino

I use this 62mm crank in my rb engine, but the 107mm rod, Ive used it for 2 seasons it done around 17000 miles now, I renewed the big end after around 13000 just before the euro as a matter of course. The case hardening had started to wear on the big end of the rod, so that was replaced. Been a very good crank at that price not over priced like a lot of others I could mention. Highly recommend it. The crankcase needs no machining just a little filing on the mouth when the crank is at bdc

Does this mean the PM 62/116 crank does not need trenching?

Edited.
Having re-read, I assume you mean the AF 62/116 Crank once it has been machined by AF at a cost of £15.

[Adam_Winstone]

Paul,

You buy one and put a couple of seasons on it. If it holds out then I'll start buying them too (fingers crossed).

Adam

[Dimitrios_231]

Sorry guys,I'm out of service enjoying myself
I'll return next week,
Adam I hope that you visited this place.



Everyone must visit this beach



A small video



P.S. Sorry for the offtopic.

[Adam_Winstone]

Ha, ha, ha. Yes, we know it well

Did you get there on the glass bottomed boat trip?

Adam

[Dimitrios_231]

I used the cheapest boat,there was glass but only on the windows

The other way was too easy for me,I rejected it

[Adam_Winstone]

The boat we went on was poor but this stop and our excellent snorkelling stop made up for it.

We also managed to find a fantastic restaurant, which we went back to time and time again, enjoying great food on the seashore

'Port timing'... just in case you thought this thread was going off track (lol).

Adam